Note that you need to activate the afterburner ("Wet Mode") manually. I'm in career mode (have the turbofan engine) and trying to get some science readings for a mission at a high altitude. Incidentally, for these speeds and altitudes, ordinary jets are the better choice. Why do many companies reject expired SSL certificates as bugs in bug bounties? At about 400-500m/s (~15km), the two engines are even. There is no such thing as "so high radar can not detect it", since radar can detect things in outer space. Range with this method is pretty short due to drag. So I've created those two planes, both with weasley turbofan engine: This is your problem-- as folks have pointed out, it's not a high-altitude engine. As I understand, the OP wanted "the most efficient way to fly", and simply needed a bit of help in realizing that that is a hypersonic, high-altitude, high-performance aircraft which is a RAPIER and a little oxidizer away from being an SSTO spaceplane. The thrust of jets (turbo or otherwise) depends on airspeed: basics deliver more thrust at low speeds, while turbojets only really come into their own when you fly very fast (which also means flying very high, 20km and over). This is the first version. principle. - but they were talking about having two intakes/engine. Building a rocket to fly vertical seems to be nearly impossible, in the atmosphere they tend to become unstable (or maybe I missed a trick?). You are simply running out of atmosphere (i.e. She has a horrible turn rate and oscillates a couple of thousand meters at cruise, but it's flyable. The drag differential is because your long-wing layout is using a bunch of struts, and the reason your delta-wing has a higher ceiling is because it has more wing area to provide lift. Because when your engine has to take in air forcefully it automatically means there isn't enough surrounding your engine and that again means that air density and therefor air resistance must be pretty low too. This way control surface max deflection can be programmed by an aircraft designer to make . When added to a plane it allows tuning of the controls vs speed/altitude/G load/other factors. My plane has turbojets and lots of fuel, but I am wondering what the optimal way to fly is. Using very light "engine rich" planes and "reverse swooping" (building velocity at 10km then gently curving up) you can temporarily get above 20km with Wheesely and Juno. 1.) Running the 60U engine at about 40U seems to give me a good balance between reduced drag and air intake. The X-37 is operated by the United States Space Force for orbital spaceflight missions intended to demonstrate reusable space technologies. Another approach, which I was managing with some success before I figured out jets, is to build a rocket and catapult yourself towards the measurement point. But maybe your patience? At sea level, it produces 120 kn thrust, but at 15 km altitude, it only produces 13.7 kn of thrust, barely enough to provide any thrust to climb higher, Long and narrow wing has less surface area to provide lift, and at higher altitude, the atmospher is so thin that the lift generated by long and narrow wings is insufficient for sustainable flight. The idea is to slow the plane to a stall above your landing spot the pop the parachute. As long a you can fly faster, the lower density at altitude can be compensated for. It has two modes: The first, Dry mode, is similar to that of the J-33 "Wheesley" Basic Jet Engine, with a bit more thrust. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. If too little air runs into the turbine your combustion chamber will not be able to burn up fuel effectively due to the lack of oxygen. *I use FAR these days, which basically means completely replacing every spaceplane and rocket you ever designed to account for its much more realistic aerodynamics. Make sure you have lots of control surfaces because at very high in the atmosphere, there's not much air for the wings to control the craft with. If you enter the Mun's SOI, it immediately counts as "In Space High over Mun" until you get below 60km Mun altitude. So, to correct " is below crosshairs", what you need to do is to add a little AoA to the wings. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. The Rapier, for example, works great as a high-altitude engine, precisely because it can go so fast. Really. If the wings are flat and your plane steadily loses altitude in level flight at a given speed (as most designs will by default), it means you either need to pitch up slightly, increasing the angle of attack and keeping your vertical velocity at 0 by flying up slightly to compensate for the pull of gravity that lift isn't compensating for. Under some circumstances, you may want to reduce the engine gimbal range or disable it altogether, particularly when flying at high speeds (e.g. But a rockets can do it. Here's my example of dealing with the situation. As high and fast as you can go without engine flameout: preferably ~2000 m/s at 25-30 km (and yes, that's almost orbital velocity). All other versions are slower and lower and unstable in turns. KSP doesn't care (much) about aspect ratio; the total lift is the same regardless of configuration. One of my planes is small and agile, and can easily enough glide to a safe landing even if the rockets consume all the fuel. So long as there's only one high-altitude measurement to take, you should be able to complete a whole set of 3-4 in one flight. Best way to get down into thicker air and land is to perform what dogfighters called a 'Split-S'. Jets drop thrust at higher altitude and speed, but also drop . . Your link has been automatically embedded. Trying to do something without the right part is long and difficult path. I don't have any exact numbers for you, but you can right-click an engine in flight and it will show both current and optimal airflow, which should hopefully let you work out the best altitude. Technically, any rocket engine is also a jet engine as it forms a high-speed jet of reaction mass. But since when do Kerbals wait for ideal conditions? You arent doing anything wrong. 3.) Each stage of the rocket has a delta-v that depends on the stage fuel mass and the engine specific impulse. A full suite of flaps on the trailing edges of the main wings give it exceptional low-speed lift, and small hydroplane steps mounted on each side of the fuselage bottom help lift it out of the water (lowering water drag) during takeoff runs. From my observations I can say that "Efficiency" is not a good indicator of how well your engine performs. Either finish the low-altitudes and then spend all your fuel on the high-altitude boost, or do the boost first and save a little fuel or try to hit the rest through unpowered gliding. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. This can make it a good alternative for when you want something that can be controllable and doesn't need excessive heat shielding, but still need to be able to go incredibly fast if necessary, at the expense of increased fuel consumption. Strictly speaking this optimisation is unnecessary, but it can win you a bit of range. Don't be too surprised if KSP's aero model breaks down in edge cases. I'm going to try adding a small solid fuel rocket engine toned down to get the initial height then dump it, as well as check into that high end gear mentioned. You can post now and register later. Of course, this thing has very limited range, speed and acceleration because of the extra weight. Your engine burns the same amount of jetfuel per second regardless of how high or fast you are! Immediately starting rocket engines at full throttle turned out to make most of my aircrafts totally unstable, turning them up gradually worked way better. jet engine efficiency in this game is based on built in thrust curves. This is my current best hi alt plane. Powered by Invision Community, Thanks, I'll go try to stuff a few extra turbojets and intakes on my plane, I was generally under the impression that basic jets were mostly deadweight on high-performance aircraft: [] at hypersonic velocities. These are the building blocks of solid spaceplane design!Subscribe! Or it can supercruise at three times the speed of an equivalent Wheesley jet (with nearly equal fuel efficiency) at 15,000 m altitude. Clear editor. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. So if you want to make a plane go as fast as possible, you want to minimise both angle of attack and angle of incidence necessary to sustain level flight at your target speed and altitude. Third, which I haven't given a good try, would be a carefully-timed deorbit maneuver so you come down through your desired location as you fall from space. And it's stock, unfortunately. So the faster you go the higher you can fly where there is less drag. Maneuver node plans don't take drag into account, so you'll have to overshoot quite a bit to compensate. The second, Wet mode, uses the afterburner to produce thrust almost equal to the J-X4 "Whiplash" Turbo Ramjet Engine, but at a considerably reduced fuel efficiency. Thank you, I was able to reach up to 24km altitude with this design. Building a High Altitude Jet | Stream pt. Arqade is a question and answer site for passionate videogamers on all platforms. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. So I'm pretty darn new to KSP, and my career has barely gotten started, and the jobs for crew observations seem to dominate If you nudge your wing's angle up slightly with rotate tool then it'll move your prograde closer to your direction of flight and significantly reduce drag. Thanks, I'll go try to stuff a few extra turbojets and intakes on my plane Do you know how many intakes/turbojet are needed to run in the regime you described? The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? How to tell which packages are held back due to phased updates. A destructible memorial to the old Mk. Yes. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. You will find that when you're flying around, will always be slightly below the crosshairs on the navball. I tried building a plane but can't climb higher than about 11,000m (I don't have many plane parts yet, though). Thanks for asking this, I've been struggling with the same problem in career mode. In this chapter, you ll learn about the Space Plane Hangar, a building that forms part of the Kerbal . Whiplash is the engine you would want to use on a plane meant to go 20km. That will unlock: Be sure to have enough intakes (I think maximum efficiency in stock is 1 ramjet intake per ~2 tons of plane, though that is aesthetically ridiculous), and if you're still running short of intake air, you can dip down a bit to speed up and get to denser air. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers.. Visit Stack Exchange It's also worth noting that this engine has the widest thrust vectoring range of all of the jet engines, with a full 10-degree range in all directions. Fighting oscillations. I'm trying to build a high altitude plane and have found out that the rules are different. What are the altitudes for the various altitude record contracts? The sweet spot for the upper atmo engines, I find, is between 10k and 12k. What you should be concerned about is atmospheric drag, and that's minimized by high-altitude flight. If drag were the only concern, at any given altitude the slower you go, the less fuel you need: the work done by drag over a distance grows linearly with speed (the force grows quadratically with speed, but the time falls linearly). If you want to cover your aircraft with loads of intakes, I'm sure you could easily fly above 35km and reach 2000+ m/s velocity. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. Mounting a time-limited rescue mission for kerbal inbound to Kerbin. That's all true, but just read the OP: hypersonic appears to be completely out of the question. Unfortunately I won't be able to test it today, but @SaintWacko's proposal sounds promising. 3x06: I design a new, high altitude, jet to collect high. The maximum cruise altitude is just over 40,000 feet. Delta-V is the velocity change necessary to perform orbital maneuvers. Very cool. This means it is better to have excessive amounts of oxygen than not to. Ep. KSP - High Altitude Aircraft 16,702 views Jan 22, 2016 172 Dislike Share Save Phoenix Fleet Systems 222 subscribers Have a type of atmospheric craft you'd like to see me experiment with? All trademarks are property of their respective owners in the US and other countries. You could try combining the two. alternatively, combine a liquid fuel rocket into your plane. AoA itself refers to the angle of the wing (or the whole plane if the AoI is 0)relative to the airflow. air) that high up. You may be correct and that 3 engine plane is a lemon. At that point your engines will be running about .7-.8 efficiency and you will be out of the thicker atmo which will allow you to go faster. 20 votes, 21 comments. In KSP2, you are a rocket scientist who must build and test rockets, spaceships, and planes. Can't remember where I saw/read about it - Scott Manley maybe? Evidence. I also had problems with a high altitude plane until I decided to follow the K.I.S.S. Hopefully this will be helpful to you. A little while back I spent a long time trying to circumnavigate Kerbin on the least liquid fuel possible (i posted the record to the sub: 254 units of fuel. More air is better. I was even able to do this with three pairs of Junos instead of the large jet engine pair (I don't have the technology level for that). Pasted as rich text. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. The Rapier, for example, works great as a high-altitude engine, precisely because it can go so fast. Since gravity is effectively lower, they don't need as much wing area to maintain altitude-- which, in turn, means less drag, which makes for more efficient flight. Editing Kerbal Space Program save files for KSO, Rasterpropmonitor for Kerbal Space Program. Sustained flight at over 20km requires at a minimum the Panther in Afterburning mode. By climbing, you reduce drag, exponentially with altitude. It's Kerbal Space Program v.22! surface of jool. I didn't try for 20000m as it probably wouldn't do well. below 5,000 m), since the engine's extreme maneuverability may allow the aircraft to perform turns sharply enough to break up in flight. For example, the RAPIER engine doesn't seem as the first choice as the "best" high altitude air-breathing engine but in long-distance and high-altitude challenges it is. KSP Career: Episode 13 - High Altitude Surveys Mike Aben 28.5K subscribers Subscribe 7.7K views 7 years ago Day 114: A busy day at the KSC with three missions, the highlights being the launch. Since turbos are almost always enough to get you off the ground and up to altitude, I usually just do straight turbojets (with some RAPIERs for SSTO spaceplanes); the minute amount of fuel saved during the ascent isn't worth lugging those superfluous engines around at the hypersonic regime. A jet engine from KSP 0.18 A jet engine is an air-breathing engine which uses onboard liquid fuel and combusts it with the oxygen drawn from the atmosphere. rev2023.3.3.43278. What's the difference between a power rail and a signal line? Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. edited 6 yr. ago. The Inland Kerbal Space Center itself, being in effect the old Kerbal Space Center from 0.2. To get higher with the low tech jet engines, you need rocket assist. Should i add a larger wing area for higher lift? 2/3 (KSP 1.11.2) - YouTube I break out the Mk2 parts and Panther engines to build a better jet that can go higher and faster. Subscribe -. Using indicator constraint with two variables, Is there a solution to add special characters from software and how to do it. Now I have a plane that will fly around the world at an altitude of the low-20s. When you are surrounded by plenty of air there will of course be no need to suck in air artificially but the higher you get the less dense the air around you becomes and in order to make sure that your engines have enough oxygen to burn the fuel it needs to suck air in forcefully. 101 kPa 1 atm Scale Height 5000 m Atmospheric Height 69 077.553 m 1.010-6 atm Minimum Temprature -40.19 C 232.96 K Maximum Temprature 20 C 293.15 K Oxygen Present Yes Contents 1 Kerbin 2 Topography 3 Kerbal Space Center 4 Atmosphere 4.1 The Troposphere 4.2 The Stratosphere 4.3 The Thermosphere 4.4 The Exosphere 5 The Kerbin System 5.1 The Mun I don't have that cockpit in my career game yet, but maybe it will work with the other one. All the information you could want to know about science, including the altitudes for each celestial body, and what altitudes a given experiment works on are available at: http://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/wiki/Science.